Improved photo upload and edit process

[cgc0202]

Improved photo upload and edit process

In Flickr, it takes only a few minutes to upload images successfully:

1. Click upload photo => Select  Files to Upload => Add Tags, Select Private or Public => Upload

That's it!  The photos have been uploaded, published the way you wanted (private only to friends, family or contact, or to the general public).  You may edit later to add more info.


In contrast to the aformentioned simplicity of the Flickr upload, the current CPG upload process is not only tedious and time-consuming but also confuses many of the Contributors to the CPG websites:

1. Click Upload File
2. Create Album(s): Optional (if not created yet)
3. Select  Files or URL  to Upload => Continue  => "n" uploads were successful. =>  Continue =>
4. Select album =>   Enter Requested Info  => Continue =>
5. Step $4 is a repeated loop until all images have been uploaded.

The previous file was placed successfully.
You have successfully placed all the files.

The "Upload successful" note in Step #3 is confusing. If the entire process is not completed up to step #5, it is as if the files were not uploaded at all, a minimum of 10 steps.  The most cumbersome steps are Steps #s 4 and #5 -- a repetitious tedious loop.

This need not be the case.

Many photos uploaded usually have common information requested (as specified in the Configuration). Thus, the contributor must be advised to upload similar photos as a batch, and the simplified CPG should be as follows:

Proposed Revised CPG Upload
1. Click Upload File
2. Create Album(s): Optional (if not created yet)
3. File or URL Upload => Select Album =>   Enter Requested Info  => Continue

"Congratulations!  You have 'n' uploads were successful". 

Simple, isn't it?

If Contributor has not provided the "Requested Info", the next step after  Step #3 would be to prompt Contributor to provide common info for all related images.  This may be done, after all the images are uploaded for a given album.

Thus, the prompt maybe: 
4. Do you want to upload more related photos for the same album? Yes No Exit
5. a. (If No:) Present File or URL Upload Form
b.  (If Yes):  Next Window would show "Requested Info"): 
Click all common information for the set of images uploaded, and provide common info
6. Do you want to provide specific info for each image?   
Present all images in the album already filled with the  "Requested Info".  At this stage, the Title plus more unique information may be added to the caption.

At the bottom and top of the page, the option (in Box): "I will do this later" should be included.


Cornelio

[SaWey]

It is difficult to get to a compromise in the upload function,
I to have the opinion that it has a lot of steps before you're done, but do you give all your pictures the same title & description?
I don't think anyone can benifit from this.
What I think would be usefull is maybe when the user has provided info for the first upload, give him the ability to save the common info and prefill the form of the next picture?

I'd like to here some comments on this from the other devs.

[TigerClaw]

Speaking about uploading process I think one very useful feature would be the mass import of images following a directory tree. I know that there is a plugin (which, from my experience, don't work very well) but I think it should be inserted in the core.

[cgc0202]

... but do you give all your pictures the same title & description?
I don't think anyone can ben[e]fit from this.

I addressed that issue, actually. In fact, many people do not even place titles to their photos.

However, I thought of the issue that you noted.

After all the related photos in the same have been uploaded -- present the "Edit List" form with the photos and form to place specific.  If you read my proposal, the common stuff -- place where the photo was taken, name of the photographer & address, common tags, etc. Would already have been filled.

Then, the contributor fills up the blanks, i.e., those specific for each photo, for example, as you stated: The Title

In the current Edit Files form, you have to repeatedly add to each photo so many stuff that are common.  Have you even tried this yourself? With 100 photos in the same album? What is you made a mistake, spelling for example, or want to add another common tag?

If you dealt with galleries from contributors, with no tags, addresses, etc. -- and there are hundreds or thousands pf them -- using the default Edit Files form is very very very frustrating.

Thus, maybe your conclusion:

I don't think anyone can ben[e]fit from this.

may need to be reconsidered.

Here's the issue:
The current default installation and Edit Files form are functionally practical only for galleries with just a few photos.

I am aware of the plugin developed by one of the core stuff to facilitate the process because he recognize how cumbersome the default installation and Edit Files form are.  However, it is only for Windows based users.

I am not the first one who raised the  issue.  There are many who are proposing ways to improve the the Upload step.  Just read the board in plugins.

My point is posting this is that this issue must be addressed.

Why keep a system that will take ten(10) steps, if it can be done in three(s). Repeat that thousands of times of images, and the tens of thousands of CPG sites already located.

Imagine how much time in the world have been wasted -- that could have been put to better used -- because of this just very simple process.

So, if you do not like my proposal, the issue is there that must be confronted.

Cornelio

[cgc0202]

Speaking about uploading process I think one very useful feature would be the mass import of images following a directory tree. I know that there is a plugin (which, from my experience, don't work very well) but I think it should be inserted in the core.

Hear! hear! I saw those plugins myself. I cannot just use it because I have a Mac.  I saw another proposal from the plugins board last night. The demo was just not working for me, but it seems that the approach proposed is similar to the general features I proposed here.

But, your proposal above would be more for Admin users. 

In a sense, the faster way for the Admin would be to use FTP to upload the photos by tree, and then use "Batch Upload" to place them in specific albums.  Using the FTP-batch upload, I can do in a few hours what would take me days or even weeks using the current CPG upload procedure.

Question:
So, why do I still need a better (faster and more efficient) CPG Upload process, and the corresponding "Edit Files" form?

Answer:
Because in one project alone,  I have more than  60,000 photos as of last year (and increasing everyday) that fellow countrymen have volunteered to share. They are used to the simple Flickr and other commercial  photosharing site. Their photos were uploaded there, with captions and all. Quite a few tried to upload them in our own photogalleries but many gave up because they found the CPG upload process quite confusing.  Eventually the others who plodded and succeeded stopped  because they found it cumbersome.

I can use their photos if I upload them myself. I have to copy their photos from Flickr and other sites. And, so I have to use the CPG upload form.

Most of my time actually involves filling up the "Edit Files" form, which is repetitive -- most of the informationn sought are the same -- usually, it is only the title that would be different.

The above is just for one project.  Because the potential group contributors is worldwide, I have more pledged images already for related photogalleries projects in such topics like ecosystems and arts, for example.  I can literally pick the best photos, if I want to, because there are so many. 

Again, the same issue, they gave their consent to use their photos.  Someone just have the patience to copy and paste them from their respective Flickr sites. Maybe, if the CPG Upoad and Edit Files form are better, more would be enticed to contribute directly by uploading their own photos.

Cornelio

[Abbas Ali]

The upload process you are talking about was implemented in cpgNG. But unfortunately cpgNG is dead now.

[Joachim Müller]

I agree that the upload process could need a re-code using an Ajax-driven interface.

[cgc0202]

The upload process you are talking about was implemented in cpgNG. But unfortunately cpgNG is dead now.

Hi Abbas,

I think I something similar to what I am proposing a few years ago (2006?).   It is one of those mass upload scripts I was considering but it was only available in Windows format. I am a Mac user so I was  not able to try it, if indeed it was exactly as I wanted 

I am curious: Why did cpgNG die?  Is there any replacement project?

I agree that the upload process could need a re-code using an Ajax-driven interface.

I agree Joachim.  I do not know much about scripting, but I use a Joomla Extension Ajax Shoutbox, and the loading is quite fast.  It is being used as a chat place for a  group that I helped prepare a webpage for.

But, apart from the speed of upload, streamlining of the entry of data would be even more critical. This will require separation of the common information (to be provided once for a group of photos) from the specific information (unique for each image).

Right now, this set of information is requested  (one photo at a time) in the middle of the CPG upload process -- the most time-consuming process -- so that it becomes the bottleneck during the upload process. 

A key aspect of my proposal above therefore (even if it is not really technical) is to remove this bottleneck in the upload process, and perform this after the upload. This step anyway should be lumped with the "Edit File" process.

Another time saver in my proposal is to have a preliminary step in the "Edit File" process -- to provide in a "single form"  the common information associated with a group of photos (see above for list of these common information). 

Why is this critical and a very great time saver?

Sometimes we make mistakes, or want to add more or edit the existing common information.  [I do this a lot with the tags.] The amount of time spent in correcting the common mistake,  adding more  or editing the common information would be proportional to the number of photos that belong to a group  --  consider what this process will consume for   10  photos,..., 100   photos, ...,   1,000  photos,  ..., 10,000   photos, etc.; and the amount of time spent becomes staggering with more photos.  Think of repeating that in case you decide to add more or edit more, for the same set of photos.

In contrast, the amount of time spent -- irregardless of the number of photos -- will be the same if the common information is provided in one single step.  A simple PHP scripting would then be used to populate each photo with these common information.

The above is just for a specific group of photos.  Think of hierarchical grouping of photos, and the same may be applied.


The specific information, like the title, obviously will be unique, so that such type of information must be in separate form, unique for each image.

A third key feature, is that in the Edit File process -- the common information and the specific information must always be treated separate -- so that the edit of one would not affect the other.


Cornelio

[Radyan]

I agree with cgc2002. Nobody likes to give a name for each photo. It's tedious. 

[Montezuma]

IMHO, the biggest hang up I have is having to manually designate each photo to an Album.  If I'm uploading 30 photos to the XMas 2007 album, why can't I specify that in the upload form?

[Abbas Ali]

Photo upload might be rewritten during gsoc program - but its not guaranteed. If this feature is accepted for gsoc, i will let you all know.

[Radyan]

Photo upload might be rewritten during gsoc program - but its not guaranteed. If this feature is accepted for gsoc, i will let you all know.

Really...this is my proposal  .
I'm just reading the third draft.The first and second ones are in the mailing list.

[bc1]

This is probably the most important issue for galleries with more then 1 contributer with more then a few images. No one wants to deal with the complexity of uploading images to my coppermine gallery, thus breaking my attempts at a group image website.
The bulk upload feature works fine, However it requires an understanding of FTP and gives access to the file structure. Not a good thing to hand out lightly, even with severely limited FTP access.
Most people cannot think past three steps (seriously). This is a great program with nice features, but this one issue completely breaks it for my users.
Cheers.

[Raven24]

Hi!
My (few) users are also complaining about the way they would have to upload images to CPG.
My friends and I belong to the "social networking generation" - in other words: we use facebook and myspace a lot. They always tell me that it's sooo much easier to upload their photos there instead of my gallery.
So I want to give you an idea for a possible upload process:

The first - very userful - thing I saw was that you create the album first with a name, location (i.e: where the photos were taken), description and privacy settings (everyone, network, friends, custom). Then you open the empty album and there is an "Add more" button.
At least Facebook uses a Java Applet to get the images on their servers. You have a little preview and you can check them with a checkbox to upload them. On mouse-over you can even rotate them instantly. In case your browser doesn't support Java you can still use a HTML form like CPG has it right now.
When the images are uploaded you see them in a list where every image is next to a textbox for the caption (optional) and you can tag people in the photo (the tagging is not exactly necessary for CPG). At the bottom of the page you can save everything and the caption becomes the text in the "title" attribute of the <img>-tag.

So there are only two steps (except creating an album): upload and caption, and the images don't even have names - only an optional title in the <img>-tag. All the "information" is stored in the description of the album.
I already found someone who made a similar applet which uploads the images to the server and then uses the batch-upload script of CPG, but that would have to be integrated into the gallery. Here's the link: http://www.aasted.org/coppermine/ At least it's easier than FTP...

[HostV]

Great recommendation/suggestions!